First 320neo to Lufthansa!

[legoboyvdlp]

Such a beautiful plane!
Anyway, Lufthansa just took delivery of the first A320neo.
Can't wait to fly on it!

[HJ1an]

Nice. But I wished airplanes weren't as generic nowadays compared to the 1960s designs.. (twin mid engined configuration ) but that says a lot about improvements and how the basic shape is refined to its most efficient.

Speaking of development, anyone come across any chart or illustration just how much engine improvements have drastically changed the way airplanes flew? I know they have leaped forward by a lot the past 10 -15 years but how much?

[legoboyvdlp]

No...
Besides autothrust, fuel improvements, new designs, 'sharktooth' 787 style rear ends.... don't think it's changed much.

I like that plane and livery for its simple design, winglets, and proportions. I couldn't tell you if it's a neo or an A320E, but.... I'm lovin' it

[HJ1an]

Those other improvements brought a lot too, but engine tech is where I'm talking about. They went from cigar shaped JT8Ds in the B737 with about 12,250 to 17,400 lbf to about 35,000 lbf in the case of similar class aircraft (A320 / B737) and even larger MD-80s, but and in the case with larger planes, leaping to an insane 53,000- 95,000 lbf thrust (ie B777 RR Trent or A380).

I'm pretty sure that's not exactly how it works (ie the number don't correspond to how the plane is flown usually, etc) but that insane improvement there was what made these planes carry so much more nowadays, and then do that, as reliably as a clock.

[legoboyvdlp]

Ah, tech.
Yep, 95k is a big difference from the Baby Boeings's 14k
Indeed.

[jwocky]

Well, a lot of it is material improvements. Those newer engines run a lot hotter at higher rpms. Then the turbine stages are shorter. New knowledge in aerodynamics (yup that works also in the engines) allowed for better optimized airflow. And the planes grew bigger, means, the room under the wings increased and thus, the engine diameter for the big planes grew easily in the 110 inch class and in some special cases beyond. The Trents of an A380 are 116 inchers. So they are even much longer than the older engines on some older planes but they still look shorter fromt he distance because they are so wide. Add to that electronic management guaranteeing optimal fuel burn and airflow under all conditions, it means they don't really drink less fuel, they just produce in the case of the Trents more power out of it. The fans in the turbines are better designed and more (the older ones had wide-chord blades). In the latest engine generation, the blades of the turbines stages are counter-rotating, that prevents vibrations and thus disturbations of the flow inside and stress to the plane's wings. And with the extra size the number of stages also increased. Old jet engines had sometimes the low pressure and two high pressure stages only, a Trent 900 has 1 low pressure, eight-stage intermediate and six stages high pressure as compressor- Thus the turbine system itself grew to 1 high pressure, 1 intermediate and 5 low pressure stages. So yeah, there was a ot of improvements, material, design based on better knowledge and also ni case of big engines, planes big enough to actually carry them. What isn't there is the one singular new technology that made it all suddenly happen. It was a thousand little steps and more.

[HJ1an]

Yes, another major improvement are the fuselage, and use of composites. If I recall correctly, the old planes are riveted all over the place. The new ones, you could maybe spot a few rivet areas.

To see that (tens of) 'thousands steps' major improvements in just the first 30 years of my life I find this fascinating. Makes me wonder what kind of "clean sheet" design aircraft if anyone had the resources to build one would look like, not just rehashing from the old designs. Although remarkable, I don't think I count the new Comac, the MRJ and the Bombardiers in that category. The HondaJet is close to one clean sheet design, but that is a very small business jet, not commercial..