USA TOUR Event | SAT DECEMBER 17TH 18:00 - 21:00 UTC

[jwocky]

@Omega: Phraseology is soo cool ... unless you deal with non-native speakers who haven't heard it before or not often enough to get that ingraining effect, you describe because they had to get up on the first (who rattled down in machine gun speed phraseology on them), the second (who became a rude ass when you mentioned that he was ATCing you into an obstacle and you climb over it), the third (who made you taxiing up and down the same taxiway several times because he couldn't figure out where North is but yelled at you the whole time to control you plane better), so you are the fourth in line, the pilot still hasn't heard phraseology and he is still a non-native speaker. Lets be clear about this: If you rattle down that wonderful phraseology on that pilot in machine-gun speed, he will probably log and fly somewhere else. But if enough ATCs doing that to him, over and over again, I wouldn't be surprised if he appears one day in a fighter jet or a nuclear bomber over one of the airports where those things happened to him. It's only human. The bad thing is, none of those ATCs who created a troll were actually malignant. Number one was probably a top-notch ATC who knew phraseology perfectly and had great procedures, he was only not able to understand, the pilot wasn't as good and therefore unable to adapt. #2 ... I have never really figured it out, but he sounded, he was already angry about something when he came on and just wanted to vent steam on a newbie. #3 was as much of a newbie as I was back then, but he thought, he had to project some authority because ... well, he was the ATC. And #4 was probably another highly professional ATC with perfect phraseology unable to understand, that his victim ... pardon, pilot ... never got a chance to learn it.
So, I was on both sides of this. Not as much as ATC, admittedly, but I have been there as well. Now, my phraseology is not perfect, I am making up sometimes my patterns as I go with the weather change and I never told anybody to taxi via alpha pass the donut booth and c32 over the gym field to runway whatever ... I just went take a left, take the third right, hold short of the runway. And yes, I asked a pilot once what the hell was he thinking what his course was and what he was about to hit on that course. All not very professional, I know. But in my admittedly few ATC sessions, I never lost a plane due to misunderstood instructions, never a pilot who logged off because I had frustrated him and not even a pilot when I had to rearrange everything to squeeze an emergency in. Never ... ever!

[jwocky]

And about VATSIM (I split that intentionally) ... I honestly don't care and have no intentions to fly there. Personally, when I fly, I fly for the fun and some relaxation. I really don't need guys throwing 116 page agreements at me. Especially not, after I can conclude form what Omega said, that VATSIM already failed it's own sole purpose to be.

[Omega]

The ATC-pilot interaction is not only a two-way road, but also a learning experience, especially for the pilot. When I control a new pilot for the first time on FG. I can assess right away whether that pilot is willing to learn or not. Most are willing to learn, and when misunderstandings happen, I'm willing to break down long instructions into separate transmissions, or point out mistakes. On the other hand, the pilots that do not want to put forth some effort into learning, I try to ignore, or get them out of my airspace as soon as possible. My tone of voice may be raised a little, but I see no point in having an argument over the frequency; as you stated, that makes matters worse and creates trolls.

Moreover, for every single instruction I give, I will make no exceptions, I don't care whether the pilot is new, or barely speaks English. If the pilot fails to understand the instruction, only then I will explain it in simplified terms. The next time he hears that same instruction, he will know exactly what to do without me explaining. The pilot will never learn if information is being spoon-fed right from the start.

Non-native speakers are not that exceptional, as you said, there are native speakers who have trouble understanding ATC. Phraseology listening skills are part of the learning experience, and flying is easier and more rewarding once you have attained these skills.

In fact, during my controlling sessions on FG, I've had several people tell me that they learned a lot because of the way I control. I've seen pilots progress from struggling to talk to ATC, to flying in and out of my airspace with confidence.

[swamp]

I don't know.... What should I fly? I would like to fly something different but the ones I would like to fly have more problems than I can tackle before the event. It may be glued to my ass again jwocky.

[jwocky]

Swamp, I have an F-5E in work. Just to get a feeling for the bird (you have to ignore the canopy though), you can try the F-5E from Dave Culp in Aircraft-nonGPL.

[swamp]

I crap thats the same one I was wanting to fly. I sent Dave a message and told him about what the FGUK work did to the canopy and that I would need to change some sound files to mono. I asked since I am not adding anything and only commenting out what is broken if I could put it on my githiub or google drive for the tour so others wouldn't have to get it from FGUK and see my canopy go up and down or possibly crash their FG if they have MP sound on. I have fixed those problems and I and at FL 360 right headed to KSUU. It flies good. The F-5 is one of my favorite fighters. The little engine that could.

[swamp]

This will be the JSBsim version FYI.

screenshot windows

[swamp]

I also looked at the F-20 but it is still is a lot of WIP I think and I have seen recently in the FG forum that he is working on it. The F-5 seems to have been forgotten. Easier fix, my eyes can only look at xml for short periods of time these day.

[Catalanoic]

F-20 is a prototipe, not commercial i think, it can't be permited for the event. but nice developed for FG (but still a lot of work to do)

[jwocky]

I did the canopy and the mono filöes, I can push it next time, but then I went into the flaps and other stuff and decided to clone it to a TigerII-JSB and that is a lot more work.