The End of Free Speech? Turn to the Community.

[Lydiot]

I’m gone for a few days out in the real world dealing with a matter of genuinely substantive importance and when I get a chance to check back on my (and I do claim joint vestment in this forum) forum, I find there is the equivalent of a backyard brawl of a bunch of 9-year-olds all trying to prove he’s the one who can be the more obnoxious and offensive than the last guy.

Ok, so let's just say that we take your concerns both seriously and at face value, is that a good deal? If you accuse people of acting like children it stands to reason that you prefer an adult discussion, so let's just look at your contribution from a "serious" perspective then.

So, first of all, your first contribution to this thread is to call people "a bunch of 9-year-olds", yet you then turn around and accuse them of being obnoxious and offensive. Do you see how that's ironic.....

Day after day, Lydiot, bomber, you show up and it is the same stuff, just dive-bombing post after post of the most un-civil stuff that your stream of consciousness spews out. Is that fun? Do you think that it’s fun for anyone else to read?

Really? Think about it. Do you honestly think the stuff you are posting is worth reading? I’ll tell you. No, it isn’t. Not when the delivery is so toxic that whatever message you are trying to get across is lost in the poison splashed across the screen.

Listen, JWocky offered a "truce" or a "fresh start" or whatever you want to call it, and I have stuck to it. IN THIS THREAD I have NOT done ANY of what you write above. NONE of it.

And you write "Day after day", as if I'm a troll that spends all my time posting here to destroy your forum... but the truth is that the last two weeks I've posted exactly THREE times:

Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:59 pm
Wed Feb 15, 2017 2:58 pm
Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:19 pm

No insults from me, no offensive language, none of that within the past two weeks.

Instead, it is YOU who drag shit up again. Do you realize that? Exactly the same thing as IHAM-COL did when he started his attack-thread on me. Waited for a long time, then dragged up something we were supposedly done with.

@Lydiot: I’m not going to ban you, but your lack of civility over months and months of posts is so antithetical to everything Free Flight stands for, I really just want you to go away. Like I said above, if you want to start your own forum where everyone can be all snarky all the time, have at it. Your playtime here, though, is over, as far as I’m concerned. If you have a shred of decency, you will either leave or completely (and I do mean completely) change your tune if you want to post on this forum. If not, head back over to Curt’s. And stay there.

And over the past two weeks had I done that or not???

You're such a fucking hypocrite. You don't say a single word about all the shit that JWocky spewed (he hasn't recently) and then when he and I agree to be nice to each other - and stay nice for the very most part for WEEKS - YOU COME BACK HERE AND DRAG SHIT UP AGAIN!

Just who is the troll here??? Do you realize that you're the troll? No? Does it need to be explained to you again? Here it is:

If two people call a truce and try to be nice to each other, and are for the most part nice to each other for weeks, and YOU come back here and YOU attack one of them and YOU are spewing a ton of insults - THAT is what trolling is!

Civiility is once again the new dawn of this forum. Argue, disagree, all you want on issues, but the day of the open cesspool of verbal toxicity stops now.

Apart from your own bullshit apparently.

Idiot.

[SkyBoat]

@ Lydiot-- You come onto my forum and mistake sarcasm for the kind of toxic verbal emesis you have regularly employed in multiple posts.

Then, true to form, you begin your strafing attacks as if the use of gratuitous profanity and a baseless accusation that I am a troll (how droll) will somehow justify the continuing battle with whatever is going on inside your head that is driving these constant hyperbolic tirades.

Your rants are boring and contribute nothing positive to the Free Flight community. As I said in my previous post, I would prefer you would have the decency to just go away.

SkyBoat

[Lydiot]

true to form, you begin your strafing attacks

There were no "strafing attacks" here.

JWocky offered to leave things alone. And I agreed.

You re-ignited something that was put to rest. Not me.

somehow justify the continuing battle with whatever is going on inside your head that is driving these constant hyperbolic tirades.

"the continuing battle"... again: - YOU BROUGHT THIS UP AGAIN - NOT ME!!!

Your rants are boring

Yet you read them......

and contribute nothing positive to the Free Flight community.

And what did you just contribute by insulting me after me and JWocky had moved on? What did you contribute? Name one single fucking thing that you accomplished by doing so. Just one thing. I'll wait.

As I said in my previous post, I would prefer you would have the decency to just go away.

SkyBoat

I will reserve the right to respond when other people start shit, you included.

You start your participation in a thread in which I have done absolutely nothing wrong by insulting me, then I'll fucking respond to you.

By attacking me the way you just did you're trolling and you're bullying. Of course you don't like it when someone stands up to your bullshit. But I'll reserve the right to do so as long as I have the possibility to post here. If you don't want to read my responses to your abuse, then don't abuse others.

[SkyBoat]

All right, here is my point. Please start using a civil tone of expression in your posts even when you are arguing over an issue or an idea. Notice JWocky has refrained from commenting on your most recent posts.

You could have easily responded to my previous posts without the heated, profanity-laced diatribes you chose to write.

I am an administrator of this forum and an independent voice. It was my assessment reading through this entire thread that was the basis of my comments, regardless of arrangements you made with others.

If you want me to listen to you, it is you have to meet my terms. You are on my turf. So, please start using a civil tone of expression when you post on this forum.

[bomber]

Am I the only one that finds it odd that people more concerned over the words Lydiot or i use in defense.

He's challenged your statements as being wrong and proved it.. the only time he posted recently was in response to jwocky childishly calling him names... to which jwocky has rightly apologiesed.

Asking someone to be civil after you've lied about their actions is a bit rich.... frankly you should expect everything you get. I'm sure even jwocky agrees that you should be able to prosecute your defense if someone's libeled you.

And I'm still waiting for the reply to my question.

[bomber]

Opening paragraph of this topic by jwocky on the 29th.

"Over weeks now, two rather rabid members of this board have, by lies, libel and slander, abused the policies of free speech on this forum"

It's not true is it... I mean Vincent didn't even start his topic until the 19th.. and it didn't go pear shaped till days after.

It wasn't even Lydiots topic about free speech, it was Vincents that he used by quoting Lydiot to drag him into an argument. Now that's trolling isn't it i'm sure jwocky can confirm.

I've been a member of this forum for quite a while now with no problems.... 3 weeks ago Vincent starts a topic that's deliberately baited to get Lydiot into an argument. An act which he and Jwocky have done in the past. I state my objections to starting that topic because a moderator shouldn't start such a topic, but rather lead by example.

Since then I've been treated quite rudely, I've had my words twisted, misinterpreted, I've been called various names over and over again.... frankly it's shown a very disturbing side of the people running this forum.

If a person can't talk about free speech without being told to shut up..... what does that say ?

If a person says something you disagree with, you can't support your ideas of free speech by saying ' that proves this is a free speech forum but you're a rabid troll foaming at the mouth and we'd like you not to ever post here or you're banned'

That ain't free speech.

I'm disgusted with a lot of what I've read in the last 3 weeks.... A home for the disenfranchised ?... Yeh but wow betide you have a contradictory opinion to them.

I'd like to thank Israel as he's the only one that's shown some common sense over the last 3 weeks.

Look after yourselves

Simon.

[SHM]

Am I the only one that finds it odd that people more concerned over the words Lydiot or i use in defense.

I'm with you both.

[oscar6662]

I'm also with you

[SkyBoat]

My response to all of you is can you provide a reasoned argument that the flame-war profanity-laced posts that several of you--yes and JWocky and Vincent have also been guilty of--has as of this moment made Free Flight a forum that will be perceived by a new-comer as a welcoming and congenial community in which to be involved?

That's the core question. Really, everything else is irrelevant. Rail against me all you want. But this is my primary goal. I want this forum to grow and attract new members. That doesn't mean I want a Disneyland "Happiest Place on Earth," fake free speech. However, the gross incivility of the recent conversations has been socially pathological and from my perspective will prevent new people from joining.

Would you join a forum where if you disagreed with something you would be attacked by one of you? Repeatedly, regardless of how you attempted to defend yourself?

Words have meaning, consequences, and power. Right now, all too often, you are using your words in a manner that makes Free Flight a dark and unwelcoming place. Even though you have free speech, do you have the right to inflict that injury upon the community?

[bomber]

That's the core question. Really, everything else is irrelevant. Rail against me all you want. But this is my primary goal. I want this forum to grow and attract new members.

Then why do you allow jwocky and Vincent to cause the conflict that they do ?

How has what you've done in the last day by stirring up Lydiot, myself and others got you any nearer your primary goal. ?

Would you join a forum where if you disagreed with something you would be attacked by one of you? Repeatedly, regardless of how you attempted to defend yourself?

But that hasn't happened has it.... Jwocky and Vincent have been doing the attacking / baiting / name calling and you've stood by and watched, giving tacit approval.

I understand this forum has the sword of damocles over it with a threat to shut it down, so I know you're in a hard place.

But I didn't set out to destroy this forum, as I've been accused of... I objected to Vincents post in which he deliberately quoted Lydiot so as to create conflict.... I've called for moderators/owner/admin to be clear about when they're posting as a moderator or as an ordinary user. I've been told my opinion is of no worth as I've not payed my debt to this forum, well I'd say there's now a lot of users who's eyes have been opened to where they stand if they voice a counter opinion. I've given 4 or 5 suggestions on the new moderator forum, and I've pointed out where you've made mistakes in the past.... not with met positively.

In the topic where Falcon announced he'd smack me down I watched both Jwocky and Vincent visit the forum and do nothing....they left him out there, knowing he was a 17 year old and that I'd respond....they could have disarmed the issue, I waited and then posted.
Yesterday I watch you visit the forum, but this time I logged on so you saw me and you posted that you'd reply later.

I'm still waiting to hear your opinion on how a person can be told to cease posting about free speech on a free speech forum.

Simon.